You know sometimes when something happens and then the next day something similar happens and you think ooooh that’s the universe telling me I must get on my Bravetank blog and write about that tonight (you’ve all been there I know) even though I should be ringing my mother who’s not very well- food poisoning we think (and yes I will ring her I promise once I’ve done this – she’s not going anywhere with that food poisoning anyway and I must not encourage dependency because I’ll pay the price when she’s in her 90s and expecting me to go down the shops for her – I mean I’ll be in my 70s then – who’ll be going for me?). Anyway that weird universe thing happened to me today so I thought I had better write about it or run the risk of a third, less subtle message (burning bush, blindness on the road to work, nothing from Santa – that sort of thing).
Yesterday I stumbled across a Twitter debate about tanks needing confidence. I won’t say who was debating – I feel kind of bad enough that I read it without commenting and now I’m writing about it on here- like some sort of sneaky opportunistic twitter thief – but in my defence the universe said I had to so I have no choice (is that the perfect excuse or what – although I suspect many serial killers have tried it yes?). Anyway I didn’t really agree that tanks have to have confidence – I mean I’m Bravetank after all – agreeing with it would have been like denying my own existence & I’d have probably started to disappear like Marty McFly in Back to the Future. But I had other pressing concerns (ice-cream to eat) so did not think much more about it. But then today in a conversation with a friend the question of whether you have to be arrogant to be an effective leader came up and I thought Oh – that’s very similar to what was being said last night – if you replace arrogance with confidence, leadership with tanking, and my friend with Twitter – yes practically exactly the same thing. So clearly the universe wants me to think about this. So I am.
So what do I think? Well- let’s deal with the arrogance and leadership question first and then think about how/if it applies to WoW and tanking (can you tell I used to lecture – I use the same structured approach with my husband when explaining why the kitchen counter should be wiped down before placing the shopping bags on it- he appreciates the instruction I’m sure – I can tell because he becomes so overcome with love for me he has to leave the house for several hours until he has a better grip of himself…).
Anyway I hate arrogance. It suggests a “full of me, I’m the bees knees” (what does that really mean?) attitude and an ego out of control. I do not think such people make good leaders. In fact in my experience they are very unpleasant to work with, full of deluded self importance and make very ill informed decisions (I’m not talking about anyone I know here, absolutely not, of course not – how much more wide eyed and innocent can I look?) But I do believe to lead you need to have self-belief and confidence – in your decisions, your vision, your strategy. This doesn’t mean not consulting with anyone or not discussing with your team. And if definitely doesn’t mean being afraid to admit you don’t know something or need to take advice. But it does mean understanding that you are ultimately responsible and accountable and that you need to take action and make decisions – you need to lead. But none of us are all powerful or all knowing (well I am sort of I admit but that’s only because I’ve watched so much Buffy it’s rubbed off on me). Sometimes we have to take a leap, make a decision that might not be right, make an assessment of the facts and decide what the right course could be and then go for it, fearlessly and confidently so that the team are in turn reassured that your direction is solid. This doesn’t mean not having any doubts deep down – I’ve had my share of sleepless nights (I’m the major shareholder in fact – do you want to buy some?) over some of the decisions I’ve made- but you do have to make them as a leader and then you must ensure your team work with you to do everything they can to deliver the right results (you know – motivation, engagement, chocolates – that sort of thing).
This could apply to tanking – notice “could” – because I have a different theory. Certainly one view might be that to be a tank you have to believe you can tank, have confidence, make all the decisions, once made go forward in the dungeon with assurance and aplomb – shield forward and all that – so everyone feels safe and secure in your presence and not like lambs being led to the slaughter (it was cruel of that DPS to make sheep baaing sounds when I took charge yesterday). Even if we don’t use the word arrogance here we could certainly use the words self-confidence and self-belief. But does a tank absolutely need all that? Oooh controversial question. Everyone sit back and gasp (or yawn and scratch – I don’t mind). Isn’t it more the case that dungeon groups need someone to do that- but that could just as well be a dps or the healer as the tank. Why is it assumed that it should be the tank?
Some reasons for this could be:-
1. The tank should pull and therefore should know in what direction the group need to go and what tactics to use. Ok yes, but anyone knowledgeable in the group could guide the way and explain tactics. It does not have to be the tank.
2. The tank has to control the pace of the group so should be in charge. Yes fine – but the healer sometimes controls the pace too (sometimes quite emphatically by sitting down and refusing to move until they’ve had their picnic). And if dps are slow that in turn will impact on the pace no matter how much the tank might want to push it (there’s nothing more tragic than three burnt out dps, a mana starved healer and a tank crying “Come on we can take them , I know we can!”)
3. The tank is always the dungeon guide. This is the deliberate mistake answer because of course they aren’t if someone else selects it. But I do have a question – are they dungeon guide by default if no one else does it – or does that go to the highest level in the group? I don’t actually know the answer to this one so it could be regarded as a Bravetank competition if you like. Noticed yesterday in Zul’Farrak that I had been appointed dungeon guide (did you hear by the way- I did Zul’Farrak!!!!! For the full effect of that imagine me all bloody faced and slurring into a mike, “I did it Adrian I did it!” & you’ll have some idea of what I felt like yesterday.) Luckily no one in the group paid the slightest bit of attention to the flag so I was able to get my neurotic head out of the map and actually do some tanking.
So I can’t think of any reason why the tank should always be the leader and should always be all knowing and confident. And tanks who are learning really can’t be. But yes the tank must be willing to tank (it’s really silly queuing as a tank and then trying to heal -particularly if you’re a DK or Warrior, or going in as a tank and then just wandering around the dungeon with fabric samples in your hand deciding whether to redecorate or not). And all tanks should try really hard and make a bloody good go of it (not stand there weeping and stomping on their shield). But that goes for everyone (there is no stomping on shields in my groups – I just won’t tolerate it. But you can grind your knuckles if you have to.) It’s no good having a dps hiding behind a rock just as it’s no good having a healer so frozen in terror they couldn’t even tickle a mole let alone whack one. So the willingness to try hard and not go to pieces behind the monitor is needed of us all. But similarly it is ok for a tank to say, “I’m learning, any help you can give would be great,” just as it’s ok for a dps to say, “I don’t know what I’m doing wrong with my rotation, I’m doing what is recommended but it’s not working, can anyone advise please,” and it’s ok for a healer to say “Lol dude I forgot to tell you I was afk and then I meant to press flash but I hit cleanse” (no it’s actually not ok for the healer to say these things & I’m still annoyed about it but he’s about to bring me in a bowl of popcorn so let’s just let bygones be bygones).
What all people need (no matter what role) is the willingness to co-operate with each other and be kind to each other. And what more experienced players need is the willingness to give advice and guidance patiently and kindly, while what the less experienced need is the willingness to listen and learn and take such kind advice gracefully. You see how often the word kind appears here. I feel like launching into a rendition of, “I want to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony.” I know how cheesy it all sounds. But just because it’s cheesy does not mean it’s not true. That would be to deny the existence of the cheese and tomato pizza I ate earlier and I couldn’t possibly do that (the scales tomorrow won’t let me). It’s true. People should be kind. And if they were everything else would fall into place.
Ahhhh – so maybe this is what the universe wanted me to think about! But oddly it made me do it while enjoying myself typing and not ringing my poor mother. How strange. Oh well- the universe moves in mysterious ways. I’ll ring her later after Coronation Street – definitely!
Hello,
First off, I enjoy reading your blog and have for quite some time. I love your rants and your stream of consciousness that flow into your entries and leads to some very hilarous run on sentences. I just wanted to throw that out there first.
I don’t want to sound like I’m taking total credit for inspiring this post, but I was one of the peoeple who fired off the initial Tweets about whether a tank should have confidence or not. It is something that I stand behind, for the most part and I think that you and I do tend to agree on what matters most.
Just to clarify, I don’t like arrogance, either. I have no desire to heal a tank or follow a tank that is overly confident, cocky, reckless, or anything of the sort. That’s not acceptable. At the same time that I don’t want overconfidence, I don’t want a tank with no confidence, either. I think there needs to be a happy medium and a lot of the tanks I’ve run into lately can’t even say that they’re in the middle, with regards to that. That’s where I have a problem.
I have a problem with tanks who don’t very hard, either, like you said and they do get emotional at the first sign of trouble, they do want to leave, and usually they do. We certainly agree on that, too. You also bring up a good point about this being a universal problem with healers and DPS, too. I guess it’s just more noticeable and more surprising when it comes from a tank, because we do expect more of a backbone or a thicker hide from them. I don’t know why that is, but it just is.
At the end of the day, I don’t expect every tank (or healer, or DPS) to be at their highest confidence their first day on the job. But, after a while, I do think it’s something you should be outgrowing, for the most part and it shouldn’t be a permanent state of mind. It’s cute for a little while and then it just becomes flat out worrisome. To me, anyway.
Thanks for your lovely comments on enjoying the blog! And your twitter conversation did largely inspire the post (inspire is a nice word for it – makes me feel better about reading something & then posting about it!). I very much agree that if someone isn’t moving past the confidence issue with experience, practice, time etc then there is definitely an issue. It could be an affectation on their part – possibly a strategy (maybe even unconscious), that habitually gets them results they desire (attention?) so they default to it or they really are just not up to it, can’t learn it & it’s stressing them out. The second is more worrying because life generally should be enjoyed – there is definitely something to conquering your fears but putting yourself through hell daily for some reason does not seem the best way forward. Anyway I would imagine most tanks do grow more in confidence eventually if they are not so totally undermined by critical groups that they give up. That’s the real risk. I’ve definitely seen improvements in my confidence — albeit microscopic and not enough to invalidate the name of the blog
I could barely contain myself afer Zul’Farrak- I was ready to tank the world!
I don’t follow Twitter, but I do let MMO Melting Pot do all the hard work and find me great posts to read so I had read Baggage at The Stories of O.
I agree with both of you, if players were treated with kindness and patience in randoms we could have an abundance of confident players be they tanks, dps, or healers. I hate to sound like I’m channeling my mommy but “treat others as you’d like to be treated” would work wonders on tank shortages, probably better than bribes.
Do I think it will ever happen in WoW, nope. The whole weird “I’m not accountable when I’m anonymous thing.” I’ve never figured that out, why do some of us carry our rl moral constraints into WoW while others don’t. Oh well, we can always hope.
I agree with treat others as you’d like to be treated – it’s so true, and yet it so often fails to happen. It makes me despair. And I agree – that anonymity seems to liberate some people in undesirable ways – they leave behind all consideration, repect courtesy etc. It’s not good.
The way I figure it, the Dungeon Finder appoints me to be meat shield, not God. If I know my way around I’ll certainly lead the way, because controlling the pace is in fact my job and the only reason to hold up is the healer’s mana or quests (and I do watch that and ask about that), but that doesn’t equate to automatically being in charge of the group. If I don’t know? I ask if anyone else does, and if they do I let them do the actual leading that doesn’t involve pulling. If no one does then it looks like we’re learning together, and if I’m not in charge of the group, then by default I’m in front of it- though with the way people are I think the two things are rather easily confused.
I think a lot of this stuff is the way our in-game roles and our social roles tend to get blended whether anyone is aware they’re thinking this way or not. The tank tends to get loaded with a lot of additional baggage beyond the job of tanking because of the way people think of how a tank is or should be, and in turn the role tends to attract people with certain kinds of personalities. I know one reason I’m so often in the job beyond simply enjoying the role is I’m unable to watch someone making a complete hash of something when I know I could do the job better, therefore queueing as a DPS in randoms tends to make me quietly insane even though I also enjoy DPS. (I feel I should clarify that simply being new and learning does not make my hash standard. It’s the worst kind of tank the DF breeds, the one that thinks their job is to charge quickly and blindly whether they know what they’re leaping into or not, that makes me come over all twitchy.)
I think it’s telling that I have two characters that can both tank and heal, and each has or has had at some time (I could cope with holy paladin in Wrath, now it’s like trying to stuff a sleeping bag back in its sack for me) a spec for each. One male troll druid, one paladin who was a female blood elf for all of Wrath. For those toons and in fact any of my tanking toons regardless of gender (and they are 50/50), DF people will automatically and persistently assume I am male, often even if corrected. On the same toons healing? Sometimes male if it’s the troll with his tusks out to here, but even for him, usually female. “Man” is bound up in people’s pictures along with other “the tank is” traits, and I don’t think it’s a coincidence.
As one last thing, there’s a difference between lacking confidence because you are learning and are quite right not to be fully confident in your abilities because you don’t have them down yet, and lacking confidence because you are fundamentally uncomfortable in the role you’re in. I’ve seen both. BEEN both, which is why my holy paladin kit will remain at the back of the closet until the Pandocalypse.
That’s really interesting. We do carry all sorts of assumptions with us about the roles/gender and roles/behaviour – some of which as you say then influences the choices we make about what roles we want to play. It’s fascinating really. Totally agree with your last paragraph as well – you can lack confidence in a role because it is fundamentally not right for you. I find that with the healing classes that has a lot of HoTs- I cannot trust they will really heal over time (total control, trust & faith issues!!) so I spam them ridiculously until I run out of mana! Disaster!
I agree with your post but sometimes its still so frustrating when a tank/dps/heals does NOT want to co-operate. The other day in Heroic BRC for instance; I’m healing on my paladin who is more than geared for it and we of course have a DK tank. A DK tank in full Bloodthirsty PvP gear with 160k health that should be MORE than easy to heal. Said DK is fully stam stacked with every stam ring, enchant or trinket you can find and gets 2 shot by the boss. Of course its my fault, right?
So we run back and I inform him that I’ve healed this place a number of times along with ZA/ZG and have never had a tank die like that. So I look at his gear.. ugh.. all the PvP crafted stuff. I look at his spec… all points in the blood talent tree.. ugh. And I just know his bags are stuffed full of lvl 85s purples to raise his ilvl high enough to even be in there.. ugh. I inform him of this and he tells me in more colorful language that I’m a LOLNEWB. Yeah, okay kid. Even the other dps spoke up and said that he was being an idiot and wasting our time.
Thats when I can’t be nice any more. I understand that people do have to learn at some time, but I don’t have time to usher and cater to everyone that wants to run heroics for valor or gear. Its not that difficult to research and at least scrape the top of the barrel on how to play, gear and spec for your class so that you’re not a hindrance to whatever group you’re in. I don’t mind going through boss fights slow and wiping here and there pending people are at least trying and not just there to get a quick carry for valor points.
Those are the tanks I can’t stand. The ones that are shaky and ask questions, I’m more than happy to help whether I’m dps’ing or healing. Need a CC? Lets do it. Not sure of the fight. I got ya. But if you’re gonna run in there like a cocky sonuva and blame everyone else for your crap? Hell to the nah, you gotsta go.
That DK tank story is not good – can’t believe he called you a newb after you pointed out to him what the problem was! That to me is not lack of confidence but a basic unwilingness to learn, to try, to be guided – all the things that are not good and lead to the problems you describe. I’ve never really thought about PvPers wanting to be carried in dungeons for valor points – it’s not right and I agree with you for not putting up with it.